I understand 螺丝 prefer professional help to her which is out of my or most of rolian's knowledge. I do not have any objection for this recommendation. However, regarding my harsh opinion to push her to grown up, following reasons, -tracyl(花花) @爱德华王子岛华人论坛:爱德华王子岛枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of PEI

枫下家园 / 幸福家庭 / 淡盐mm, 我理解你。在我看来，你已经做得很好了！当初我带第一个孩子时候，也是很不适应，看着别的妈妈带孩子那么轻松，我就更觉得自卑，压力更大了。 -pkmxlp(冰冷酒); 2012-11-22 {912} (#7916432@0)
那时候最怕别人说：“我当初比你累多了，不也没事。。”相比之下，更觉得自己很无能，很无助。所以我理解你确实需要很多照顾很多爱，但是爱是祈求不来的，是不能靠等的，如果你苦苦地等着别人多给你一些爱，结果往往会让你失望，你得先付出爱。你看，当初你不要孩子，现在居然辛辛苦苦把孩子拉扯大了，你多了不起呀，也许对别人代正常不过了，但对你却非常不容易，所以你为宝宝付出了很多爱，所以宝宝也同样回报给你很多爱，她甜甜的笑容，撒娇的模样，对你深深的依恋。。。它在你的精心呵护下快乐成长。宝宝是最纯洁的，你付出多少，他会成倍的回报你。世界对谁都是公平的。

你没有他也会活得好，他没有你却不能活。你很脆弱，他比你更脆弱。所以要学会放下那些让你怨恨的事情，把注意力力集中在宝宝身上，他是你的血脉，你的骨肉，不管你愿不愿意，你已经是个母亲，一个弱小的母亲。但在孩子眼里，你就是天！

放心吧，生活会在你一点一点付出中慢慢变好，记住，不要让怨恨占据你的心，不要老想“我需要照顾，我需要照顾”，这是思维定势，其实你应该比你自己想象的更坚强！

我觉得淡盐MM的问题,不是独立坚强的问题,而是心病.因为这些本不是她想要的,如今强加在她的头上,让她不堪重负.而LG又不理解,认为女人这样做理所当然.很多网友也觉得不可思议,觉得她实在不够坚强. -3662930(aveeno); 2012-11-23 {526} (#7916731@0)
每个人的情况天差地别,人的想法也各种各样.大家还是多理解理解她的心态,不要把自己的想法强加到她头上.

女人想要孩子,会尽一切的可能坚强面对.连花钱借种的都有.但孩子不在淡盐MM的计划中,她自然想不开.孩子是男人想要的,但如今却要她来面对,自然要有无限的怨恨情绪.

病人需要理解,需要迁就,这是基本的常识.大家都是照顾过父母的,应该知道老人住院时你只能说好话,顺着他们的意思.而不是谴责病人不够独立坚强.这样对病情毫无帮助.就是一个很坚强的男人,生病的时候也需要家人宠的,因为这是最脆弱的时候.

所以,请很独立坚强的大家,不要用自己的标准来要求别人.

你说的很对，这正是我病的根源，可是LG不愿去理解这些，我知道他是不想负担这些。 -pika2005(淡盐); 2012-11-23 {244} (#7916975@0)
昨天他和他的家人通话，他家人竟和他说我这病要好几年不会好的，叫他做好准备，把这事告诉我的家人，否则万一我死了他要担很大责任。还计划让我回国，让小孩回国，说小孩他们来带什么的，还问他我会不会伤害小孩这种话，说我LG好可怜。人心在关键时刻就体现出来了

你老公下班后帮你做家务看孩子吗？。。。 -redsky(忧伤苹果之睡不醒的冬); 2012-11-23 (#7916989@0)
你俩好好过日子，别管老人家怎么说。把老公哄好，多交些一样带孩子的朋友。其实你老公听起来还是很不错的，俺生孩子的时候只请了一周假，那时候刚找到工作一个月，老板多给都不敢要。过去这段日子，小孩子会说话，满地跑，不用抱的时候可好玩了。熬过一两年就好了。 -ysysning(樱桃果果); 2012-11-23 (#7916999@0)
别想太多，争取早上班。孩子找住家保母。 -newhouse(梦中的苹果树); 2012-11-23 (#7917066@0)
Human being's first reaction is always to care about self before thinking about others. -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 {307} (#7917195@0)
Your behaviour may have scared your husband and his family to death at this moment.That's why they may be defensive and protective too. I think your parents-in-law's suggestions may not be bad ones. If you cannot take care of yourself in Canada, why not go back to China and have someone take care of you.
MM, do you have any plan about how to move on? what is your plan for the future? your body may be sick and tired, but you can still think and decide in which way your family is going. -pkmxlp(冰冷酒); 2012-11-23 {151} (#7917213@0)
your past behavior scared your parents in law. if you can stand up and tell everybody that you and your baby are ok, they will shut up to your husband!

她都钻另外一牛角尖里啦，听不见了。。。她LG也是笨，都成这样了，赶快花钱请个月嫂呗。也是个老抠。谁认识她家的，去帮帮忙呗。一群人干着急，啥用没有。俺闭嘴不说了。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917224@0)

叫沉默的有她老公电话,还有她英文不好,大家尽量写中文 -rendaozhongnian(威尼斯的水); 2012-11-23 (#7917232@0)

sorry, I cannot type 中文 in the computer. -pkmxlp(冰冷酒); 2012-11-23 (#7917234@0)

没有孩子的人生是缺憾的。年轻的时候也许不觉得，等年纪大了就会体会到没有孩子的家庭太缺乏生气了。 -402(WOW); 2012-11-23 (#7917878@0)

早先是淡盐发帖求助，冰酒的帖子是写给淡盐的。是些实实在在能帮助她渡过难关，起码给自己弄口饭，不会饿着的帖子。你的帖子是顺应了淡盐目前的心理思维，但是谴责她LG有用吗？不仅没用还起反效果。估计LG下班又是一顿吵，更要挨饿了。 -luckymom(五月); 2012-11-23 (#7918353@0)

是老婆生孩子,LG没生,没生的就将就一点儿生的吧,一辈子就这么几天.有上网说家务的功夫,买慢炖锅,速冻饺子,速成食品，找家庭厨房和餐馆的电话给LP.为吃口饭的事把自己的LP孩子逼出个好歹,钱不白赚了？ -022007(Party Animal); 2012-11-23 (#7916867@0)
偶一毛钱都不能同意BZ大人所说的女人要理解男人赚钱养家的压力，女人就算不赚钱，赚钱辛苦女人能理解，男人能换位理解一下女人生孩子的辛苦吗？别说生孩子，你天天背30磅东西坚持十个月试试。 -022007(Party Animal); 2012-11-23 (#7916887@0)
她应该马上去看医生.一贯支持她,不指出她问题,她会更恨老公,更加林黛玉.这个怀孕是已经发生了,她老公坚持生下来也是保护她的身体. 她是爱自己比较多的人.这个就是为啥她不喜欢孩子,恨老公不能给她更多的照顾.现在他老公醒悟的话,就花钱请个保姆帮太太从家务中解脱出来. -rendaozhongnian(威尼斯的水); 2012-11-23 (#7916928@0)

confess一下，俺单身的时候最讨厌孩子，特别是看到小孩子哭闹，恨不得趁他爸妈看不见的时候，上去踹两脚，一有自己孩子，看别人家小孩子哭，都想跟着哭，特受不了。俺老婆之前，也不会做啥家务事，现在一个胳膊抱俩，还能边炒菜，一荤一素的。 -ysysning(樱桃果果); 2012-11-23 (#7917013@0)

这个牛：现在一个胳膊抱俩，还能边炒菜 -almondcake(爱吃土豆); 2012-11-23 (#7917030@0)

有什么可炫耀的，女人那么彪悍还不是男人太窝囊造成的。 -aibengbeng(粉色版Sponge Bob); 2012-11-23 (#7917043@0)

是是，母亲伟大！！！ -ysysning(樱桃果果); 2012-11-23 (#7917046@0)

父亲也伟大，大家分工合作 -almondcake(爱吃土豆); 2012-11-23 (#7917064@0)

女人强悍是因为做了母亲，为了孩子辛勤劳作，那是累着并快乐着，和男人是不是强悍没有必然关系，对成年人我也不认为男人必须照顾女人，尤其是中年以后，男人其实也更需要女人的呵护，如果说男人是女人的头，那女人该是男人的颈椎，既然谁都离不开谁，那就想办法协调工作， -chuyi12(初一); 2012-11-23 (#7917072@0)

BZ大人觉得一个女人＂一个胳膊抱俩，还能炒一荤一素＂是真爱，还是无奈？能问一下，您LP炒一荤一素的时候，您干什么呢？ -022007(Party Animal); 2012-11-23 (#7917245@0)

是真爱也是无奈。是真爱，因为她为这个家付出，为孩子付出，是无奈，因为俺们最艰苦的时候，存款只有四位数，不上班不行，请不起保姆，家里全靠俺工作收入....老婆炒菜的时候，俺刚回到家里，躺在沙发上，跟死鱼一样只有出气没有进气..... -ysysning(樱桃果果); 2012-11-23 (#7917290@0)

比我强了。几年前我最困难的时候还欠着银行4位数，也没有男人为我去抢银子^^ 果果嫂还是不够强悍，她应该把你一并抱胳膊里，再炒一荤一素。^^ -princemeetsprincess(西门小鸟); 2012-11-23 (#7917306@0)

笑喷。。。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917324@0)

同意你！有时候大家真是好心帮倒忙。 -chuyi12(初一); 2012-11-23 (#7917028@0)
哈，你也太搞了，坚持生下来是为保护她的身体？这么体贴情深意重的老公现在怎么这样了？ -sanercindy(33); 2012-11-23 (#7918312@0)
严重同意。从非凡学校帖子开始就是你的粉了。 -luckymom(五月); 2012-11-23 (#7918365@0)

有的孩子好带有的不好带，有的人能干些，有的人干活效率低些，比来比去是毫无意义的 -pitaya(pitaya); 2012-11-23 (#7917038@0)
冒着被砸砖困惑的说一句：母亲爱自己的孩子是天性吧？看着孩子粉嘟嘟的脸还有啥不满意的？还有啥想不开的？天天纠缠着LG有啥用啊，他要不出去挣钱，天天俩守着喝西北风就NOT BLUE啦？为了孩子都要让自己过得好，身体好，看着孩子长大。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 {82} (#7917158@0)
还在纠结当初说不要孩子的约定。难道还能把孩子塞回去？若真人在我面前，我真要骂醒她！

is this 休克疗法?! I think she may need understanding and softer suggestions, but, anyway, no body know better about her than herself. -pkmxlp(冰冷酒); 2012-11-23 (#7917169@0)

算啦。当初就是极其讨厌林黛玉，所以拒绝看红楼梦。不过这类人真见过，以前公司一人，有次感冒了，就怪她LG让她开冰拿那东西了。成天在公司就捧心状。女人还是强悍点儿好。自打有了孩子，发现我就一野蛮人了。哈哈。。。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917209@0)

林黛玉是真的有病，这位是作 -erotica(erotica); 2012-11-23 (#7917240@0)
自己没有经历过的事不要妄加判断。 -annesnoopy(snoopy); 2012-11-23 {230} (#7917507@0)
自己没有经历过的事不要妄加判断。没得过产后忧郁就不知道那种滋味，就象睡的好的人永远不会明白失眠的痛苦。产后忧郁医学上早以正式定义，而且得病的妈妈绝不在少数。责备决不能让一个已经很忧郁的妈妈变好。多多理解吧，不能理解也不要雪上加霜。

我有过，一个人抱着孩子哭。我相信每个妈妈都或多或少有过。家人帮助是一方面，自己调节也是很重要的。我还因为带孩子失眠，到现在有时候都需要吃安眠药。我前些贴子都说能理解，可看多了就觉得有点儿。。。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917569@0)

人和人不一样，我一个朋友就是不生，说宁可离婚也不生。认为生了养了孩子她就不是她了，没有比这个更惨了 -barbell(barbell); 2012-11-23 (#7917219@0)

俺以前也不生，死也不生。然后不小心就生了。从知道那一天起，我就知道给我什么我都不会换他了。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917227@0)

但这位是生出来了还是不开心，咋办呢。 -tattooo(绿茶); 2012-11-23 (#7917260@0)

Good question"咋办呢" especially for this poor baby. She/he does not know how to complain and need support every moment. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917327@0)

俺顶你！ -congcongo2(congcong); 2012-11-23 (#7917241@0)
I agree with you too. Does anyone think about the baby. Does the baby deserve mother's care? Who's responsibility to raise this baby. My opinion, only whoever want to support themselves to fulfill their responsibility deserves the public help. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917270@0)

Hey, lady. Too harsh!! Tone down a bit. If everyone knows their responsibility and is able to fulfill his/her responsiblity. No public help is needed. I don't think you are ignorant enought not knowing something like "mentle health" problem!!!! -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 (#7917283@0)

这个我要帮花花说两句。她是恨铁不成钢。前几天宝贝坛援助一个妈妈时，她可是忙前忙后的。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917292@0)
Thanks for telling me this. I think I am a little bit too harsh now since this topic has been last too long after so many people trying to help, she is still insisted about her own benefit, and never put the baby's benefit on top of hers. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 {71} (#7917302@0)
Motherhood is nature, if she can not get it soon, it might be too late.

Motherhood is nature, but it does not come natually for every mother. There is something called mother-child dysfunction, which refers a state of difficulty in forming proper attachment between a mother and her child. -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 {149} (#7917355@0)
It is obviously to me LZ needs professional help. Seeking for internet help or comfort or attention is not a good idea at all for her at this moment.

Looks like you have some knowledge on this. Why don't you do some research on how to get help on her mentally? -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 {98} (#7917361@0)
Generally speaking mentally illness patients post a risk to the public, in this case to the child.
http://www.globalwinnipeg.com/ottawa+to+introduce+new+bill+to+keep+more+mentally+ill+offenders+behind+bars/6442758963/story.html

what's your ponit? Stop helping those who are mentally ill, let them make mistaks and then lock them behind the bar???? -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 {176} (#7917441@0)
I think the government only sends out the message that the mentally ill need to be responsible for their behaviour to some extent, but not saying that they don't deserve help.

We can only help somebody who realize they are ill and they need to coordinate and willing to improve, right? Look at this case on line has been on going for so long, has she changed even a little bit even to realize her responsibility? -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 {549} (#7917493@0)
Hopeful you are the one who have the ability to help to get some professional knowledge after her husband worked for so long along with her husband family.

You wrote "Seeking for internet help or comfort or attention is not a good idea at all for her at this moment. ". So the longer it stay here, the more risk to the baby since she will be more possible to focus on the on line world rather than real baby.

I posted government news just want to warn anyone in concern that it would be too late just arguing here on line if tragedy happens.
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/two-children-found-dead-south-london-120143106.html
I hope this mom will see "government only sends out the message that the mentally ill need to be responsible for their behaviour to some extent" in order for her to realize it's better to pick up her responsibility as a mother which her baby deserves. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917518@0)

The bill refers to the criminals mainly. Please do not apply that to the poor Mum's situation. She has Postpartum depression (PPD) only, which normally won't harm others at all. -payday(tuesday); 2012-11-23 {235} (#7917739@0)
I agree with you that she is not mature enough to be a mum, but pls pls do not be so harsh. She needs professional help to get over the blue period. That's the priority. It's not the right time to tell her to grow up and get strong.

幼我幼以及人之幼."depression normally won't harm others." Then how is her baby? If everyone "do not be so harsh" to her, be gentle to say "you are acceptable to expect anyone's help", can you guaranty the baby's safety? Every child is precious. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7918097@0)

Shame on you to think her as 'mentally ill '. To belittle other people won't make you a better person! -payday(tuesday); 2012-11-23 (#7917769@0)

是那个螺丝先说楼主是mentally ill,不是花花。what's your ponit? Stop helping those who are mentally ill, let them make mistaks and then lock them behind the bar???? -luosi(螺丝); 14:44 (176 bytes. #7917441@0) more -tattooo(绿茶); 2012-11-23 (#7917771@0)

so 花花 has every right to say that, right? -payday(tuesday); 2012-11-23 (#7917805@0)
Go back to their previous postings and you'll understand what 螺丝 really meant. -payday(tuesday); 2012-11-23 (#7917839@0)

I understand 螺丝 prefer professional help to her which is out of my or most of rolian's knowledge. I do not have any objection for this recommendation. However, regarding my harsh opinion to push her to grown up, following reasons, -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 {654} (#7918035@0)
1. I did encourage her husband to help and to be strong to support her as much as he can. She need his help the most and he is responsible to their family too.
2. She need to show that she is trying her best to grown up and be independence to her husband and others because I do not think anyone have the capability to keep putting effort on a patients who do not have any intention to grown up.
3. CAS has already been involved, how long can she afford to keep complaining without any improvement at her side.
4. Too many tragedy happened for depressed mother who hurt their own child, Just google mother kills children, you will find too much cases.

那个住地下室的妈妈比她惨多了吧。缺衣少粮的。孩子不也才５个月。我帮那种妈妈我觉得值，帮得爽。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917288@0)

Did you deliver the rocker to her? One of my friends will deliver some clothes, some new comtainers (Bought by Newmam2010, thanks) and some food to her this weekend. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917348@0)

yeah. aibaobao sent them to her this Wed. -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917554@0)

Good, thanks. I believe "那个住地下室的妈妈" a good mother, no money, nowhere to live, no husband, no family's support, no clothes, no furniture, even no dryer after washing baby's cloth in basement, however still raised a healthy little baby alone. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917572@0)

because she is mentally healthy, this case is different -pkmxlp(冰冷酒); 2012-11-23 (#7917577@0)

How do you know "she is mentally healthy". I thought that most of mother's suffered depression more or less after baby's birth. This depression is from nature too since physically we lose something from our body. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 {122} (#7917583@0)
As long as mother work hard on baby daily, the depression will be gone soon since this is a distraction to the depression.

There are smart people, but someone can be called gifted. Most people experience depression, but some may even fall in extreme/clinical range. -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 {112} (#7917607@0)
Intensity and severity differs, you know. The only way to help the baby is to help the mom, no other way around.

Do you mean " smart or gifted people is not that easy to get depression". I thought I fell into smart or even gifted group, however I still get depression with both husband and mother's help at baby's birth. Maybe I am over thought about my IQ. Haha -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917614@0)

compared depression to IQ. smart < gifted vs. normal episode of depression < extremely clinical deppression case. -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 {156} (#7917624@0)
It is a matter of degree, or how depress you are. She is absolutely very ill as she had already taken an action; while many others may only have S thoughts.

The only way to help the baby is to让那当爹的花钱请月嫂。说真的，孩子最可怜。 -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917620@0)

I have no word for the daddy. But he may be depressed too, plus confused, scared. The whole family needs professional help. That's why there is only family therapy, just just mom or dad. -luosi(螺丝); 2012-11-23 (#7917626@0)

不是说CAS都介入了么？好象安排了心理医生的吧。我记得她说什么花钱找人听之类的。ANYWAY，还是要她身边的人有所作为。做糖醋排骨去了。各位周末愉快！ -ashura(碧落); 2012-11-23 (#7917636@0)

你还不能走，要先说清楚 -ysysning(樱桃果果); 2012-11-23 {22} (#7917645@0)
要记得排骨先油煎一下。
周末愉快 to you too. Have a busy time in order to get a happy mood. No depression for sure as long as we work hard on our little ones. -tracyl(花花); 2012-11-23 (#7917698@0)

happy black friday!! -whatislove(什么是爱); 2012-11-23 (#7917730@0)

@PEI

I understand 螺丝 prefer professional help to her which is out of my or most of rolian's knowledge. I do not have any objection for this recommendation. However, regarding my harsh opinion to push her to grown up, following reasons,

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